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Avengers: Endgame (Spoilers)

 
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Bob Morris



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 2834
Location: New Mexico

PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2019 10:37 am    Post subject: Avengers: Endgame (Spoilers) Reply with quote

I saw Avengers: Endgame for the second time and wanted to get a few thoughts rolled out about it.

Namely, I wanted to focus on what I think it's most important to think about regarding the film, and that the themes it explores, rather than the plot devices and how they work.

I'll get one thing out of the way: Time travel rules vary from work to work, whether it's books, TV, films, comics or anything else. The only thing you have to keep in mind is that, within a specific work, you are being consistent with the rules. I know that's hard to follow in some ways with Endgame, because it doesn't follow the rules like, say, Back to the Future does.

So I can understand why the time travel plot device is a problem for some people. Because those people tend to think in terms of how they view time travel should work.

That aside, I can forgive some of the issues with time travel because of the overriding emotional themes that are explored, namely about family and loss.

Let's look at each of the primary characters who go about undoing Thanos' work.

Tony Stark: Still has Pepper Potts, now has a daughter, but lost Peter Parker, who you get the idea he thinks of as a son.

Steve Rogers: Lost two of his closest friends (Sam Wilson and Bucky Barnes) and somebody with whom he shares a moral compass (T'Challa) along with others he considers family.

Thor: Watched his adoptive brother and one of his best friends in Asgard die, then failed to take down who was responsible.

Rocket: Lost every member of the Guardians, who he considered family.

Nebula: Lost Gamorra, who she finally saw in Infinity War as a sister.

Natasha: Lost several friends who she considered family and now worries she's losing...

Hawkeye: Lost his family and has become despondent.

Bruce Banner: Similar to Natasha, only without a Hawkeye.

Scott Lang: When he gets out of the quantum realm, he's worried that he lost his daughter.

Rhodey: The only person who hasn't lost somebody close to him, but sees others who have.

There's this constant theme about what family and close relationships are all about, what happens when you go through loss and how you deal with it.

It's the one thing that Thanos can't understand when it comes to his grand plan -- even the one person he is closest to (Gamorra) isn't enough for him to reconsider. He has no such relationship that keeps him grounded.

But among the heroes, the only one who doesn't fully have it at first is Nebula -- but she gains it along the way. Thus, each of the heroes, by the time they are taking up their grand plan is focused on what they have lost and willing to do whatever it takes to get it back.

We see this again when Tony Stark runs into his father and Steve Rogers catches a glimpse of Peggy Carter. In each case, there's a close relationship they lost.

I think it's that overriding theme of family and loss that really makes Endgame work -- and that's why I can forgive it for some of the plot points. The theme is just so good, so well written and one in which just about anybody can relate to it, that it's what really sells the movie.

That's why I think Endgame ranks as one of the best installments in the MCU.

I'll probably have more thoughts as they come to mind, but the whole family theme -- that's such a powerful theme that it makes the film work, despite a few flaws.
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Steve Yohe



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 2740
Location: Wonderful Montebello CA

PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reading that post made me think that the reason I don't react to the film like most people is just me. I never was into family. Family doesn't mean shit to me. I was 6'3" at age 12, and at that time, I decided I would live my life as I wanted, and I wasn't into Iowa farmers, living in California who just talked about ways to make money. The family didn't mean shit to me. My Father & Mother were great people but they bored the hell out of me. I wanted to get away from them as soon as possible. I never wanted to be part of any family.

I also ended up in the Army (twice for over two years), Viet Nam, and was a nurse for 35 years. People died all the time, they also came and went all the time. Many of them were my best friend. I lived with 100's of them, and it was great, but guys would get orders to move on. And that was it. We all knew it wouldn't last. Maybe you feel bad, but you get over it. Some of them died. I thought about it for 30 minutes, and moved on. To be like that, is a good thing.

I worked on a burn ward for well over two years. People with their faces, noses, ears, arms & legs burnt off. I liked it a lot, because I was playing ball on major teams. Did I feel sorry for these people...NO. Feeling sorry for them would have killed them. They had to get out of bed....feel the pain...and get better. They trained us burn nurses to not feel other peoples pain....because we had to be that way to make them better. If a burn nurse felt something it would drive you crazy.

I worked on the floor of a hospital for 33 years. People died all the time. I do not have the same feels about death, like other people. To me, with the old and the really sick, it's a good thing. Hell is being semi-comatose lying in a bed 5, 10, or 20 years. All you know is people coming in and turning you every two hours. No one should be in that position. I see death as a good think. And it happens to everyone....I don't think it's that bad for most people. For a nurse, the first time your PT dies...it tears you up. You have to get used to the fact it isn't your fault...it happens.....then you move on. You get over it.

My father & mother died...I got over it. I've had a ton of women in my life...three major ones....maybe 20 others of different types...fulfilled & unfulfilled. Was married to two. But women come & go...for all kinds of reasons. You try to not make mistakes....but you move on....and there always is another. I've only had one bad relationships, but she was crazy to begin with. You value the time & move on. You get over it...it's part of being a man. You have to give things up.

So watching a movie with all type of super heros crying about all they lost is bullshit. In 7 years you can get over anything. Your not very super or tough minded if you can't move on. Crying over shit doesn't help. It get old real fast. Just don't think about it. Deal with it & forget it. There supposed to be tough guys.

A lot of people create problems because they need emotion. If they don't have problems, they create them. They feel off the emotion. It's bullshit. So they love it in film. Look at Mexican soap operas. The kids growing up today are wimps who are protected every step of the way. They live on emotion because they don't have it in life.

So the Avenger stuff doesn't have much meaning to me. But it's nice...I can see it. But it isn't my type of movie. But it's my fault, because I am the jerk I am.---Steve Yohe
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