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khawk20



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 234

PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 6:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Honestly Ken I have no idea what is happening when you are trying to register there. I have been a member forever and a day so my registration was as I recall just a straight sign up. Perhaps emailing the Admin, Loss, might solve your problem. I'll see if I can get you his email.
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Ken Viewer



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
Posts: 300

PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks very much, Kevin.

Your efforts are appreciated.

Ken
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Ken Viewer



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
Posts: 300

PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kevin, I've been skipping around the Pro Wrestlers Only site and am sorry to have bothered you. The place is for younger fans who favor the WWWF-and-later wrestlers.

I'm a fan of the older eras and, as you know, spend a lot of time tracking down footage of some of the legendary wrestling matches of yore. (I also tracked down and found one of the two newsreels clips of Nijinsky, the dancer, and that is a story for another time and maybe another board. I received apologies from people I never heard of who had debunked my claim the film had ever been shot. Turned out the bunk belonged to them.)

I also, when my brain is switched on -- which is several times a week, keep up with some massive changes in the interpretation of the United States Copyright laws, as defined and redefined by the U.S. Federal Courts.

Effectively, on-point, the most important Federal Court to rule on the subject, the United States Court of Appeals for the Second Circuit, including New York City, has reinterpreted or redefined aspects of American copyright law, which, in my opinion (and I covered the specific case as a reporter until I couldn't get to the lower-Manhattan courthouse where an en banc proceeding was being held in open court) changed the game.

(The United States Supreme Court has refused to consider an appeal of that decision or to hear the case, making the Court of Appeals' declaration the law of the land.)

Under such an interpretation, again, in my opinion, the newsreels/wrestling-films/wrestling historian "Raging Bull" has lawfully secured "Fair Use" rights on the version of the Jim Londos vs Dick Shikat 1930 wrestling bout "re-cut" that he posted on Youtube, for free, wherein Londos won the first and only National Boxing Association world's heavyweight wrestling championship and his own first world's heavyweight championship. (There actually is film from a separate non-Londos/Shikat match in the jumble.)

Essentially, Raging Bull has a copyright on his version of the match, or so it can be asserted, if he ever cares to.

Someone at the PWO tried to grab it and embed it in an otherwise simple-minded (in my opinion) presentation and analysis of the footage.

Raging Bull has blocked, and I applaud him for it, embeds. To see the 19 minutes of the bout we so-far have obtained, out-of-order, is, at best. confusing. Ask Yohe.

Raging Bull re-cut and put back together the highlights of the full match, and folks have to go to Youtube, where the new version of the various segments of that match, which Yohe, Kit Bauman and I purchased some six-or-more years ago, in full Fox Movietone News sound-on-film footage, is posted.

Though Raging Bull and I had previously discussed such a purchase, it wasn't then practical. But when Yohe and Bauman and I finally got our stuff together and bought copies of the 19-minutes worth of the match, in out-of-order pieces, Raging Bull received a bicycled copy.

Here's a summary of the appropriate U.S. court-decision and details behind it. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cariou_v._Prince

Years of research went into the Londos vs Shikat film-find. I need to hang out with an older group of wrestling fans who favor the older styles.

Not nice for whomever to have tried to lift Raging Bull's work without properly crediting him and directing would-be viewers to his Youtube channel.

Beyond that, WWWF-world-and-later fans have seen matches I never have or want to. I may be senile, but I'm senile with a smile -- when I can find a mirror.

Ken
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DGinnetty



Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 107

PostPosted: Fri Oct 07, 2016 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve Yohe wrote:
Steve Yohe
660 S. Taylor Ave
Montebello, CA 90640


Oops. First time checking this board out in a week.
I will send the discs out ASAP.

Hope you enjoy them

Dan Ginnetty
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Steve Yohe



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 2751
Location: Wonderful Montebello CA

PostPosted: Sat Oct 08, 2016 1:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan

I need the old VCR tapes back too.

Yohe
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DGinnetty



Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 107

PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve Yohe wrote:
Dan

I need the old VCR tapes back too.

Yohe


No sweat. I wanted to hold onto the tapes until John could check them out and verify the conversions were acceptable.

Dan
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Steve Yohe



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 2751
Location: Wonderful Montebello CA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan

Yeah keep them as long as you want....but I do want them back. They mean a lot to me. I trust you. Your reputation precedes you.

I don't want them to go thru John. I was testing John with this project & the game is over.

Thanks

Yohe
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DGinnetty



Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 107

PostPosted: Wed Oct 12, 2016 2:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve Yohe wrote:
Dan

Yeah keep them as long as you want....but I do want them back. They mean a lot to me. I trust you. Your reputation precedes you.

I don't want them to go thru John. I was testing John with this project & the game is over.

Thanks

Yohe


Understood. Tapes and dvds will go straight to you.

Dan
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DGinnetty



Joined: 06 Aug 2006
Posts: 107

PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2016 12:56 pm    Post subject: dvds Reply with quote

Dvds were sent today. you should have them by the weekend.

Once I get word that the VHS conversions are acceptable, I will send your tapes back.

Thanks again

Dan
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Steve Yohe



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 2751
Location: Wonderful Montebello CA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2016 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great

Thanks

Yohe
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khawk20



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 234

PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2016 4:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ken Viewer wrote:
Kevin, I've been skipping around the Pro Wrestlers Only site and am sorry to have bothered you. The place is for younger fans who favor the WWWF-and-later wrestlers.

Ken


Loss finally got back to me and he seems to think he validated your account.
Just so you are aware.
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Steve Yohe



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 2751
Location: Wonderful Montebello CA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2016 2:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dan---got the DVDs last week ---Thanks--Steve
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Ken Viewer



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
Posts: 300

PostPosted: Mon Nov 07, 2016 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

khawk20 wrote:
Ken Viewer wrote:
Kevin, I've been skipping around the Pro Wrestlers Only site and am sorry to have bothered you. The place is for younger fans who favor the WWWF-and-later wrestlers.

Ken


Loss finally got back to me and he seems to think he validated your account.
Just so you are aware.


Thanks for your efforts. If he validated my account, I still can't figure out how to post. Someone there put up the link I had originally posted to the 1929 Dick Shikat-sparring-with-Toots Mondt newsreel-footage that includes the presentation of a world's title belt by Ray Fabiani to Shikat, and Mondt, Shikat and Fabiani speaking. Also, it's the only known footage of Mondt wrestling.

Since I co-found the film and Steve Yohe, Kit Bauman and I paid for that digital footage (years before it was uploaded by the UofSC to their own, copyrighted site, so that there could be a link) to be made available via DVD, I have a few observations on its posting -- I mean, we could have purchased three safety-film copies of the film and made those who wanted to see it get their own 35 MM projectors and sound equipment)...

But I couldn't sign in because it says I have to wait for an okay from the moderator or owner.

If a person on that board swipes our links without giving us (or me) credit -- from where I first posted them on the WCMB's Lou Thesz Forum -- that's neither nice nor does it encourage us to spend more money at other archives I've found that are full of classic wrestling footage -- and plenty of film exists.

I stopped posting at the WCMB since Mark Nulty died and the chemistry of the board changed (everything changes over time), but the search for footage still goes on.

For those who want the link without having to go to the WCMB archive I created, or the site with the lifted links, here it is:

http://mirc.sc.edu/islandora/object/usc%3A28626

The footage itself is courtesy of the University of South Carolina and was filmed near Philadelphia by William Fox's Movietone News in synchronized-sound-on-film at the very dawn of commercial-talking-pictures. Most of this footage, prior to our discovery and recovery of it, had not been seen since the day it was filmed 87 years ago.

The Strangler Lewis 1916 match in New York City (filmed by Carl Laemmle's Universal newsreel), portions of which were shown on the same reel as a battle between Pancho Villa's Mexican-Revolution army and his monarchist and U.S. opponents, including the Hearst family, is still being restored. I don't know who Lewis's opponent on the silent film is, but hope Yohe and others can identify him when the film has been converted to digital format for viewing.

Ken
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Steve Yohe



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 2751
Location: Wonderful Montebello CA

PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2016 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ken

You can post you video stuff here. John isn't talk to me now, but I'm sure he'll welcome it. I would put it in the LINKS section & try to keep it all in one spot. Do your own thing.

I don't think Sullivan comes here.

Yohe
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Ken Viewer



Joined: 04 Aug 2006
Posts: 300

PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2016 7:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve,

I don't care who posts here and who doesn't. Same with the WCMB. What changed there is the rules of civility were discontinued for a few specific people who had been banned from the site while its owner Mark Nulty was alive.

I don't participate at Wild West sites and when that policy changed, I withdrew.

Whatever new links I find that I can share I'll be happy to put up for linking here and perhaps at a more active wrestling site -- assuming I find one.

It comes to mind the project to create an archive of wrestling-match-and-promo films of over half-a-century old--and-more was one I originally suggested here. JDW responded that was okay but that I should provide it in raw format so you fellows could decide on how to handle it.

I decided I would make such choices and the archive actually ended up at the WCMB, which at the time had strict rules of behavior. All the sites available have problems with methodology of creating data bases. More recently, there are ways to create searchable archives on most sites.

Here's the only so-far-known film of Ad Santel (cutting a promo vs. midgets in 1919 in or near San Francisco for a match perhaps against Jim Londos -- yes, the year of 1920, as provided by the source, is one too late).

Footage courtesy of the University of South Carolina and filmed by Fox Newsreels (silent); posted by Raging Bull because they haven't. There is some signficant emulsion damage but the footage is viewable and unique --and, no, those are NOT children; several of us examined every face and there was unanimous agreement all the faces are of adults. Otherwise, it would never have been posted by any of us:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yh3aKW3v4wc

Ken
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