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Golf Thread (a/k/a/ Tiger Scoreboard)
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Rian



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 2223

PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 3:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The PGA does have walking officials with EVERY group...The Masters is not a PGA-sanctioned event. I bet that will change next year.
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jdw
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My understanding is that US Open does. The PGA Championship is a little mixed: I've seen one where they're with the Last 5 on Sunday... and another where they have it with every group, unlike the Masters. I don't think the Tour Stops have a walking official (i.e. someone who knows the Rules and how the apply to the specific course) with every group from Thu-Sun.

John
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Yakuza Rich



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rian wrote:
The PGA does have walking officials with EVERY group...The Masters is not a PGA-sanctioned event. I bet that will change next year.


I'm not sure which one you meant, but the Masters will not be a PGA Sanctioned event. It's an invitational and it's always been understood that the Masters and ANGC can run the tournament as they deem fit.

I don't know about the rules officials, but I know that the volunteers that control the ropes that allow fans to cross the fairway actually pay ANGC $30K to be a volunteer (yes, you read that correctly). The reward is that they get ANGC all to themselves for 1 month after the tournament.

Anyway, if it's Augusta, they will make sure that it's their people or they won't do it at all.





YR
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Yakuza Rich



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

jdw wrote:


On the Tiger stuff... I don't know the rules. I frankly think it's nuts that the PGA doesn't have walking officials for every group in every event. I know it's a lot of groups (30+ for the Masters in the first two rounds, 50+ for the US Open)... but still.

John


Rule is fairly simple. He can drop from where he was or closer to the hole and it has to be in line with the flight of the ball as it first crossed over the water. He dropped well behind it and admitted to it. The idea for him was that he just hit the shot, so take 2 yards off and hit the same shot and he will be close to the hole. But, you can't drop from behind where he was.

He really should have known that. The rules are extremely complicated in general; but this ain't one of them.








YR
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jdw
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2013 6:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree that he should have known the rules. I just think that in a tourney with $8M in prize money (and lord knows how much in revenue) that it's kind of goofy that they don't have, with every group, the equiv of a Ref who they can check with... or who can say, "No... can't drop from there."

Coaches in the NFL should know the rules. We see every year some that are wrong on some. :)

John
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Yakuza Rich



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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I agree with you on the Rules Official on each hole.

I think what you're missing is that in general, the rules of golf are extremely difficult to understand. A few years ago Nicklaus talked about this and said that he found to fully grasp the rules is about the equivalent of passing the bar exam in terms of difficulty.

However, this rule isn't one of those rules that is difficult to understand. And what's mind boggling to me is that the Rules Committee initially didn't think it was an illegal drop.

There are some times when a player hits the ball into the hazard and the place to drop requires a rule official. I think that hole really should not have much confusion, so I think not having a rules official on that hole is a complete oversight.




YR
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jdw
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 16, 2013 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not disputing whether this was an easy or hard rule. Simply that having an official with the group, making an on the spot determination, and you live with it.

An example:





That's a clear penalty from this weekend, with a front view and a back view (which would be the ref's).

The ref didn't call it. Beats the hell out of me why he missed an obvious massive grabbing of the shirt inside the box. But he didn't call it.

Chelsea, the team in black, got screwed by it. But... that happens in all sports. You bitch about it, but you live with it.

In the Masters case, maybe a walking official at the time Tiger ponders where to (incorrectly drop) tells him, "Can't do it there..." and Tiger goes to where he should be. Or maybe the official misses it. Either way, a discussion is made at the time. Not several holes later... and then yet again overnight.

That's the massive clusterfuck of golf here. They can't get it right "at the time" because there's no ref there like there is in every other sport. They botch it several holes later. They "get it right" over night, which now causes Tiger to sign a wrong scorecard... which he signed effectively with the blessing of the tourney when they made their intial ruling.

Just one giant clusterfuck. Which 100% could have been avoided if there was a "ref" type person with the group making a decision that everyone would have to live with.

In turn, if certain refs screw up enough times, then they're out of their gig. :)

John
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jdw
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2013 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What an insane home stretch to The Players. This will likely be remembered for Sergio's double shot into the drink on 17. But that was hardly the only ebb.
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jdw
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PostPosted: Fri May 17, 2013 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ken Venturi, 82, dies 11 days after Hall of Fame induction

When they mentioned him this weekend at The Players, I had a feeling it was bad and didn't want to google it for confirmation. :(

John
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corrado



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
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Location: LI

PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2013 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.golfchannel.com/news/golftalkcentral/garcia-controversial-tiger-woods-remarks/

this is getting ugly.
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jdw
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PostPosted: Tue May 21, 2013 6:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I guess Serg is too young to remember Fuzzy busting out that joke, and how poorly it went over back then.

John
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jdw
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 8:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lee and I watched most of the coverage of the four rounds of the US Open. Tense, drama building, really compelling Open. Merion consistently beat people up each round, giving little chances here and there, but largely feeling like hole after hole of "just take your par here and get to the next hole".

Feel sorry for Phil, and but for the eagle on 10, it wasn't a strong round for him. 17 & 18 were snapshots of the round. He needed to give himself a birdy put on 17, but instead was trying to save par. On 18, he really needed to hit the fairway to give him a chance to control the ball onto a green with a brutal pin placement... and instead was in the rough off the tee. There will be a lot of talk about puts not falling, but a lot of them were tough longer puts that he read "well enough" to make it look like they might go in... but he really needed to be several feet closer to the hole on each to make them easier to drop.

Rose gave himself just enough margin to work with and avoided big mistakes on 14-18 coming in. Which is strange to say about five holes that he played at 2 over coming in. But they were brutal holes, and he was more in control in that stretch than Phil and Day and Mahan.

Fun major which makes one look forward to the Open, the PGA and the rest of the season.

John
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Yakuza Rich



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 5:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The tournament was great. I guess it never ceases to amaze me that people bitch about the dumbest things like 18 not being birdie-able. If they made 18 a par-5 instead of a par-4, it would still be a par-71 course and we would have those precious birdies. And Rose almost birdied the hole anyway.

The US Open, when done right, is about hitting good shots. Hit good shots and you get reward. Hit bad shots and you get your dick kicked in. That's why I don't feel sorry for Phil. He's an awful driver of the ball and he's playing a course that doesn't allow for it.

I thought Merion was boatloads of fun to watch. You could see birdies and double bogeys on virtually any hole. The crowd was great, cheering on Mickelson on his shot to tie on the 72nd hole.

The problem for Merion is it can only fit 25K fans where as the typical US Open course fits about 45-55K. There are rumors that the USGA lost $10 million having it at Merion. To me, it was money well spent. Hopefully 10 years from now they'll give it another shot. Although I think they are hellbent against it.






YR
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Rian



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PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 7:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Doesn't the USGA want to make the US Open winner around even par for the entire tourney? Fairways and greens, take advantage where you can and try not to give up shots. Sounds easier than reality?

Heard some of the houses on the course rented them out for the week for upwards of $40,000. I'm sure they'd love for it to come back in 10+ years.
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Yakuza Rich



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PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2013 9:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The general idea is that the USGA wants the winning score at par. But, whenever the winning score is nowhere near par they say 'we don't keep in mind what we want the winning score at.' :)

There's no doubt in my mind that those houses were renting for that much. Houses that are at Augusta rent for even more and they are not on the course.

The last time I went to the Masters was in 2007. My dad and I went for a practice round and my dad approached one of the volunteers. This particular volunteer held the ropes where the people crossed a certain section of the fairway.

'How did you get to become a volunteer?' my dad asked.

'You have to get on a waiting list.' the volunteer replied.

'And you have to pay to volunteer.'

'Really?' my dad said

'Yep, I paid $30,000 to volunteer here. They let me play unlimited golf here for a month after the tournament is done.'

'And it's worth every penny.'


My dad and I still think the guy is a loon.








YR
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